Just curious what other I-Pace owners are paying per kWh in different parts of the country, or the world for that matter (if you care to convert to USD). Based on simply dividing my electric bill by kWh used, I'm at $0.112/kWh. I do NOT utilize an off-peak plan, since in Florida we cannot defer our most consumptive appliance, our AC, which is needed most during the day.
What is your kWh rate? Do you have to use off-peak plan to get it?
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In Alameda, CA (municipal power instead of PG&E), my average charge across tiers, EV discount (no TOU support on island), and customer connection charge was $0.1625/kWh. I expect that will be lower starting next month, as my solar array gets turned on on Wednesday.
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My self generation (solar) rate is currently 0.06510 / kWh.
But have to pay monthly service fee of $21.60.
But have to pay monthly service fee of $21.60.
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If you have the ChargePoint home EV plug-in charger, the app tells you which electric company you're using and tracks your kWh usage. Here in Florida, the FPL rate is currently what you quoted above. I drive my I-Pace approx 19k-22k/year, so approx 1,600+ mi. per month, and I'm spending $80-$110/month on electric at my home vs. about $350-$400/month I used to spend on gas for my Porsche Macan Turbo (not to mention the maintenance costs). :laugh:
We have TOU (Time of Use) billing via smart meters on our homes. Off-peak rates are 6.5 cents per KWh, Mid-peak is 9.4 cents per KWh and Peak is 13.2 cents per KWh.
I totalled the past three months and came up with my average cost of 7.7 cents per KWh, but when looking at the actual charges on my bill with all manner of regulatory nonsense and taxes, it is closer to 8.5 cents per KWh.
That might seem steep, but I also have a solar array on the roof that generated 10 MegaWatt hours last year and was paid $3500 for that, so in effect, I pay virtually nothing for electricity. Well, unless you count the $30,000 to put the panels on the roof. Lol!
Timbo
I totalled the past three months and came up with my average cost of 7.7 cents per KWh, but when looking at the actual charges on my bill with all manner of regulatory nonsense and taxes, it is closer to 8.5 cents per KWh.
That might seem steep, but I also have a solar array on the roof that generated 10 MegaWatt hours last year and was paid $3500 for that, so in effect, I pay virtually nothing for electricity. Well, unless you count the $30,000 to put the panels on the roof. Lol!
Timbo
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We have both home and work to deal with, and they are very different. This is Southern California with over 20,000,000 people.
Home:
Time Of Use plan allows us to charge from 10pm to 8am cheaply. This is also a good time to run other electric devices such as pool pumps, washers, dryers, dishwashers that have timed start functions. It's roughly 0.13/kWh for power+distribution+fees last I looked.
Work:
There is a 20kW peak draw cutoff which forces you into a Demand Based Tariff. This is $200/month for the meter, $17.32/kW for the draw, and 0.075/kWh for the actual electricity consumed.
To give you an idea how this effects EV charging by businesses, Let's say your normal bill is $2000 in the 4 month summer tariff. And now you want to all EV charging with a bank of 3 x 7kW EVSEs.
Before you pay for a single kWh of EV juice, just to have 3 cars plugged in at the same time for 15 minutes during the month is $363.72 plus whatever power costs and the capital costs of the equipment. Assume each car loads up on 10 kW average (people will try and fund their EV charging at work), that would be $45/month for the power, or $410m / 3 = $34 a week for a 30 mile round trip commute. Gas is $4/g here, so that would be $20/week if they were driving a 30 mpg car.
You can see where this is a business decision that amounts to a donate to the SCE.
We fought back, and went all LED, rotary compressor, R-22, 4 high efficiency ACs, and 24.2 kW (rated peak) of solar array.
Of course SCE charges us a money fee for having solar, and the permit was over $2200, but all was well for the first year.
Then SCE decided that the cheapest power rate would be the daylight hours where solar power is produced. When the sun starts to set, they rape you.
Sound nice? It's not. A well engineered solar, overproduces from 10am to 2pm on a typical day. Overproduction value is now less than 1/2 what they used to allow for.
So the new TOU windows and permit fees, and monthly fees, and Demand Tariffs all create a situation where it is not a good business decision to have EVSEs for your staff or solar on your roof.
This was totally different in 2015, before California attacked Green Technology for businesses.
If California Day time power is so freakin' cheap, then why shouldn't I put in a DCFC? Because the power is cheap, but you cannot afford to dispense it at 50kW. That's $866 / month for the first 15 minutes of use.
OH!! Sign up for a separate EV plan. Figure $4000 infrastructure, $25,000 for the device, then it would actually cost more to charge cars. Remember that $200 Meter Fee? Now you pay it twice, and still pay the demand fees.
Home:
Time Of Use plan allows us to charge from 10pm to 8am cheaply. This is also a good time to run other electric devices such as pool pumps, washers, dryers, dishwashers that have timed start functions. It's roughly 0.13/kWh for power+distribution+fees last I looked.
Work:
There is a 20kW peak draw cutoff which forces you into a Demand Based Tariff. This is $200/month for the meter, $17.32/kW for the draw, and 0.075/kWh for the actual electricity consumed.
To give you an idea how this effects EV charging by businesses, Let's say your normal bill is $2000 in the 4 month summer tariff. And now you want to all EV charging with a bank of 3 x 7kW EVSEs.
Before you pay for a single kWh of EV juice, just to have 3 cars plugged in at the same time for 15 minutes during the month is $363.72 plus whatever power costs and the capital costs of the equipment. Assume each car loads up on 10 kW average (people will try and fund their EV charging at work), that would be $45/month for the power, or $410m / 3 = $34 a week for a 30 mile round trip commute. Gas is $4/g here, so that would be $20/week if they were driving a 30 mpg car.
You can see where this is a business decision that amounts to a donate to the SCE.
We fought back, and went all LED, rotary compressor, R-22, 4 high efficiency ACs, and 24.2 kW (rated peak) of solar array.
Of course SCE charges us a money fee for having solar, and the permit was over $2200, but all was well for the first year.
Then SCE decided that the cheapest power rate would be the daylight hours where solar power is produced. When the sun starts to set, they rape you.
Sound nice? It's not. A well engineered solar, overproduces from 10am to 2pm on a typical day. Overproduction value is now less than 1/2 what they used to allow for.
So the new TOU windows and permit fees, and monthly fees, and Demand Tariffs all create a situation where it is not a good business decision to have EVSEs for your staff or solar on your roof.
This was totally different in 2015, before California attacked Green Technology for businesses.
If California Day time power is so freakin' cheap, then why shouldn't I put in a DCFC? Because the power is cheap, but you cannot afford to dispense it at 50kW. That's $866 / month for the first 15 minutes of use.
OH!! Sign up for a separate EV plan. Figure $4000 infrastructure, $25,000 for the device, then it would actually cost more to charge cars. Remember that $200 Meter Fee? Now you pay it twice, and still pay the demand fees.
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My rate here in Alberta is $.0549. We do have transmission and distribution costs on top of that that add double?, but not sure the exact cost. I normally charge at work. They have installed a bank of 7 Kwh chargers that we can use for free. I think my total electricity charge since November has been less than $10 and I have more than 5500 km on the car.
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Sounds complicated. Too much math to think about. LOL! :laugh:
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Wow. I can't believe all the typos in that. I hate this "10 minute edit" limit.
You will start to read the fine print the first time your bill jumps from $1100 to $2500 per month. :grin2:
But I started my research when I had to teach myself how to design my PV solar system. To get the most bang for your buck, you must 'right size' the system. Too big or too small increases the number of years it takes to pay the system off. My system should pay for itself in 2.5 years. I'm 1/2 way there.
If you don't mind saying, what do you do that a system that large will pay for itself in 2.5y? Also, does it have batteries as well, or just power for daytime?
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Equipment costs were $30,000, and 30% tax credit on the project. I self installed with some hired help. My annual power bill was just over $16,000. It is now <$3,500. Commercial systems can be cheaper. The 2.5 years was based on original calculations. They changed the tariff schedules in March, so that might increase the time to payoff.
If you start with something like this, you just have to buy racking, and I used tool-less DynoRaxx ballasted racks. I added 4 kW of panels pointed for best "late day" output after seeing my power curve. And there were taxes, permit, small parts, purchased labor.
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You must have a massive house! We're two buildings and ~3500 square feet, and our bill with solar and battery ends up being about $1000/year. Without solar, and with the electric water, heat pumps, and well pump, I figure we'd hit ~$6000/year worst case scenario.
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It's a commercial building, 8,000 sq ft, 'flat' roof. Fire code restrictions limit the actual available surface area quite a bit. The building contains 4000 sq ft of 68-72°F of laboratory area that must be maintained 24/7/365. And the lab equipment is air powered so we run a 7.5HP rotary compressor and line dryer.
We haven't run solar at home due to fear of roof leaks and servicing issues. Maybe when we retire we will put up home solar too.
The business will effectively generate $1,000/m in additional income starting in 2021.
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