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Discussion Starter #1
I understand the I-Pace steering wheel does not have any electronic adjustment available - no memory, no automatic movement for vehicle exit and entry, no nothing. Just a manual unlock lever and manual vertical and horizontal adjustments.

This seems really odd. Even my ancient Lexus - from the last Century - has fully automatic steering wheel adjustment. I suppose I'll get used to it, but it would have been a nice little feature to have included, at least as an option .:confused:
 

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Yeah, the owner's manual lists a manual adjustment system, up/down, in/out.
 

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I'm not here to poo-poo anything about the Jag, as the more decent-range BEVs the better, as far as I am concerned, but that said my benchmark for comparison is Tesla and this seems a pity.

Tesla allows a number of named driver configurations [so more than just some 1, 2, 3 buttons allow] and shows them in a pull-down select list. They can be linked to a fob (and then that config is loaded when you open the door - but as mentioned in another thread its flawed and does not work well if a passenger also has their fob with them).

When we swap drivers the only thing I (as driver) have to adjust is the rear view mirror (which then seems a pity that they didn't motorise that ... another 1st-world-problem!). There is no memory on the passenger seat.

There must be some things not include in a driver-configd, but I'm not sure I can remember them. Cabin temperature (driver side) for example. That stays at previous setting (and might well have been adjusted from APP - when paying bill at restaurant to turn on climate :) )

There is also an exit mode, but unless all you want is tilt seat back a bit and move steering wheel up, the delay for the whirring of the motors isn't great. I mean ... 0-60 in the twinkling of an eye, but move seat back is measured in glacial units

Some of the settings are explicitly included in the driver config (if you move the seat a SAVE button appears on dash (showing the config-name) for a few seconds, but many are saved implicitly - e.g. if I turn on/off auto-dipping headlights I'm pretty sure that just gets added to my config without a save.

So if I loan the car to anyone even though they might NOT press SAVE when they move the seat (but they might <sigh ...>) anything else they fiddle with becomes part of my driver profile. Including the Tesla Driver who drops off loaner and takes my car for service ... and returns it.

So I have a Guest driver setting ... which I have to remember to set before loaning car to anyone :)
 

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... and another thing ...

If Tesla give me a loaner none of my settings are transferred. Opportunity missed I reckon. When driving a loaner I find all sorts of things set differently to my preference, of course, which can turn out to be a safety issue as I only discover that during driving. Choices for CREEP on / off and so on
 

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Discussion Starter #5
I agree, TO. Tesla's approach is not perfect, but I do like the way they push the envelope on details like this.
 

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Neither car has a digital rearview mirror which sort of blows away something like a fully adjustable manual steering wheel vs. a motorized unit.

The DRM needs no adjustment. Just point it right at yourself if you like, it doesn't matter. If passengers or cargo is in the back, they disappear as do the pillars. It has about 170° field of view and can see into your blind spots.

That will suck not having DRM on a $80k car, there's no excuse for that. It's a safety feature. The motorized steering wheel? I've had expensive sports cars with manual steering and seats.

The Tesla's lack of a 360° bird's eye view and no HUD at all is also puzzling at that price point. This is stuff that comes on $40k and under cars, and again are safety features.

Both the Tesla and i-Pace can be forgiven for lacking 4-wheel steering (very handy), massage seats, reclining rear seats (although these are avail on some JLR products). and individual rear HDTV entertainment, because some $100k cars don't have these. EV drivetrains cost a lot more than a ICE drivetrain, so you must cut costs somewhere, and these are not safety blunders.

Jaguar did not opt for a motorized steering wheel. One would assume it was a cost cutting measure, not an engineering decision concerning safety. Ditto for the digital rearview mirror. But it's actually kitted better than a Tesla when you option both out.
 

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I'm not especially concerned about the steering wheel position. My wife is 5' and I'm 6' and we both put the steering wheel as far out and as low as possible.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Neither car has a digital rearview mirror which sort of blows away something like a fully adjustable manual steering wheel vs. a motorized unit.
I agree. I had the digital rearview mirror in the Chevy Bolt, and loved it.

Neither the motorized steering wheel nor any of the items you mention are really big deals for me. The manual wheel just struck me as incongruous in a modern luxury car; Cost cutting doesn't sound right, because Jaguar is not shy about charging for features, both standard and optional. But not a dealbreaker or anything.

Actually, the thing that troubles me most about the I-Pace is its wide turning circle - nearly 5 feet bigger than my current car (Lexus LS400). The Jag's body is also a few inches wider than my old car, and I will definitely miss the Lexus' maneuverability in the garage, on the road, and in parking lots. Still not a dealbreaker for me, and of course no car is perfect, but I do wish the I-Pace could turn tighter than a minivan!
 

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I had the digital rearview mirror in the Chevy Bolt, and loved it.
Interesting. I've never driven a car with one, but I had formed the assumption (dangerous that!) that having to change focus would make a digital one "different" if not "annoying". But now I think about it I suppose I have to do that every time I look at the instruments too ...

Cameras instead of wing-mirrors same thing presumably. That's got to be an improvement worth having? [I know legislation hasn't caught up yet] (Surprised F1 cars haven't done that ... those sticking-out, and tiny, wing mirrors must be an Aero issue)

the thing that troubles me most about the I-Pace is its wide turning circle - nearly 5 feet bigger than my current car
Is there any obvious reason for that (related to BEV)? or is that normal for similar Jags and just something that Lexus have done well?

Hadn't really thought about the turning circle of the Tesla. Had small hatchbacks before, so the size of Tesla is a big issue (especially in UK as parking spaces are small). However, the transmission allows switch forward/reverse at low speeds (maybe 5 MPH max?), so I can do a three-point-turn with just flick of "gear"s selector and a dance on the gas pedal which works surprisingly well for manoeuvring; i.e. after selecting reverse some gentle gas provides "deceleration, and then propulsion". Maybe Jag will allow that too?
 

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Actually, the thing that troubles me most about the I-Pace is its wide turning circle -
The wheelbase on the i-Pace is exceptionally long for the OAL. It has a longer wheelbase than Tahoe (large SUV), or any of the Teslas.

Here's the turning radii of various cars, curb to curb not wall to wall (cars with longer noses/OAL need more room for cars or walls than shorter cars):

Model S - 20.35' (116.7" wheelbase, 196" long)
i-Pace - 19.65' (117.7" wheelbase, 184.3" long)
Tahoe, large SUV - 19.5' (116" wheelbase, 204" long)
Model X - 19.4' (116.7" wheelbase, 198.3" long)
CT6 - 18.5' (122" wheelbase, 204" long)
LS400 - 17.4' (111" wheelbase, 196.7" long)

Whether an i-Pace will get into a tighter parking stall would have to be tested. It depends where the bumpers are. But the short length is certainly an advantage when parking.
 

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DOH!

Chrysler Pacifica Minivan - 19.85' curb to curb, 204" long.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Tesla specs on the Model S turning radius show 18.5' - not great, but far more respectable than 20.35. I rarely have problems with car length, for me it's a narrow width and tight turning circle that help the most with maneuverability in town.

I don't think there's anything about EVs that hinders a good turning circle. It just seems to be something a lot of carmakers don't care much about. Perhaps I'm unusual, but I find good turning ability makes a car much more pleasant to drive in the city; makes no difference on the road, of course. Doesn't pretty much any transmission allow shifting reverse/forward at low speeds? I do that every day in the old Lexus, backing out of my garage.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
How about the Honda Odyssey? 203" long, 188" wheelbase, but turns in an 18.3' radius - better than the much smaller I-Pace or the similarly small Model 3.
 

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The wheelbase on the i-Pace is exceptionally long for the OAL
I thought the i-Pace having the wheels on the four corners was a good thing (handling and increased cabin-space; don't need bonnet/hood if no engine ...)

If that continues to be a BEV solution (to combat battery weight) maybe rear-wheel-steer will become a thing?
 

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Tesla specs on the Model S turning radius show 18.5' - not great, but far more respectable than 20.35. I rarely have problems with car length, for me it's a narrow width and tight turning circle that help the most with maneuverability in town.

I don't think there's anything about EVs that hinders a good turning circle. It just seems to be something a lot of carmakers don't care much about. Perhaps I'm unusual, but I find good turning ability makes a car much more pleasant to drive in the city; makes no difference on the road, of course. Doesn't pretty much any transmission allow shifting reverse/forward at low speeds? I do that every day in the old Lexus, backing out of my garage.
Yes, that more likely. I typed in 'Model S turning radius' in the Google Chrome window, and it gave me the 20.35' number.

It is more of a hindrance if you take it off-road. Then it's a critical feature. 3 point turns are not always an option on a fireroad.
 

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I thought the i-Pace having the wheels on the four corners was a good thing (handling and increased cabin-space; don't need bonnet/hood if no engine ...)

If that continues to be a BEV solution (to combat battery weight) maybe rear-wheel-steer will become a thing?
It's an engineering trade-off. The chassis must be made stronger since the wheels are further from the CG, it increases the turning radius, and it reduces 'high centering' ground clearance.
But it gives better response when cornering, improves wall-to-wall turning radius, allows for more interior room, and normally improves approach and departure angles of attack.

Rear wheel steering is nice, but it too is a trade-off. It increases weight, consumes room, adds price. It is not new tech, but it has never gained wide acceptance. I think it's an important feature on a big car. The extended wheelbase GM SUVs (Suburban and Yukon XL) had it as did their pickups at one time, and few ordered it. All Cadillacs CT6s with AWD have it.
 

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I understand the I-Pace steering wheel does not have any electronic adjustment available - no memory, no automatic movement for vehicle exit and entry, no nothing. Just a manual unlock lever and manual vertical and horizontal adjustments.

This seems really odd. Even my ancient Lexus - from the last Century - has fully automatic steering wheel adjustment. I suppose I'll get used to it, but it would have been a nice little feature to have included, at least as an option .:confused:

I agree it seems odd for a car of that price, but to me sure seems like a way to save money for the company and offer it as "that much less than a Tesla". That being said it sure wouldn't be a deal breaker for me. I could care less if it was manual or electric because I know first hand when they break, it's an expensive fix (when my motorized wheel gizmo broke on my 95 VDP). For me it's one less thing to break and I can adjust that wheel faster manually than wait for it to electrically gear into position. Seat has to be recallable for me, but wheel - no. Or the tailgate - I could care less if it was manual or self closing. I'd rather save the money and have manual steering adjustment and manual tailgate and put the money on the wheels I like.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
(cars with longer noses/OAL need more room for cars or walls than shorter cars)
Ok, now I see what you are saying. Yes, the I-Pace' relatively short snout would tend to reduce its wall-to-wall circle. Maybe it'll be decent for many of the situations I'll need to maneuver. Thanks
 

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Discussion Starter #19
I could care less if it was manual or electric because I know first hand when they break, it's an expensive fix (when my motorized wheel gizmo broke on my 95 VDP).
In my experience, a Lexus never breaks. Twenty years with the LS, and none of the motors have even thought about breaking. I know, Jaguars are not like that. Still, the I-Pace is cool, and I figure what the heck, I can live with a few breakdowns or repairs. :wink2:
 

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I can adjust that wheel faster manually than wait for it to electrically gear into position
I agree one-more-thing-to-break, and Tesla is covered in mini-motors - even the door handles are "self presenting" ...

But the time-to-move (seat / wheel) is not a thing as fob is linked to driver profile, so as you open the door everything starts moving and unless you & spouse are giant / midget its gonna be done by the time you are actually sliding in.

If seat moves I don't suppose that whatever position a (manual) steering wheel was left would prevent ingress, but maybe it would for some? The Exit Profile on Tesla tends to be steering-up, as well as seat-back, so maybe it matters to some

Or the tailgate - I could care less if it was manual or self closing
Same thing there really, useful when you need it. My wife would struggle to reach the tailgate when it is up. And approaching the car with an armful of shopping having self-opening is nice. And it stops opening if there is something above it, a manual one is just going to bump into an obstruction I suppose (assuming you don't realise in time ...)

But, yeah, proper 1st-world-problems.

Back in the old days I would always go to the passenger door, unlock it, and open it for my passenger, and then close it. Then go and clamber into the driver's side.

Central locking knocked all that chivalry out of me ...
 
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