Jaguar I-Pace EV400 Forum banner

1 - 20 of 39 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
112 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Bjørn Nyland has posted a video of his testing of i-Pace Lane Assist

If you don't know of him: Bjørn started out as a Tesla YouTuber, won a Model-X in a referrals competition, gave up his day job and now gets asked to review EV cars and so on; whilst he may well have a Tesla bias he does have experience of lots of different EV models


My take-away was that it works very well but disengages (time? lack of hand-on-wheel?) without giving any warning alarm (so, for example, if medically incapacitated the outcome would not be good ...) by comparison Tesla sounds increasingly more annoying alarms, and if still no response puts the hazard flashers on and comes to a stop (albeit in-lane rather than on-shoulder)
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
1,929 Posts
"this is really weird"
at 8 min in

there are definitely bugs in this implementation .. however, when the system is on it seems to work well.
in the US it's $1300 more than driver assist .. i might just add that to my order :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
112 Posts
Discussion Starter #4
there are definitely bugs in this implementation ..
I'm reading that the "disengage with no audible warning" seems to be common in other brands too.

I'm scratching my head trying to figure out how that is sensible ...

... actually, no I'm not, I'm going "WTF" !!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
112 Posts
So, it deactivates without telling you? That's awesome. Can't wait to see some crashes...
I want to like the iPace so much, but I keep coming back to AP and super chargers...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
309 Posts
I ordered autosteer, just for fun, but I don't plan to use it much nor ever rely on it. As far as I can tell, the technology is just too primitive and too unsafe at this time. That goes for Tesla as well as Jaguar and all the others.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
141 Posts
Interesting, seems to work pretty well once he used it when he got out of that weird section where it kept adding passing lanes for a bit and then merged back in.

The nag does seem odd though--I think they should be a little more forceful. Do we know how they are determining driver awareness? By far the best solution out there is the eye camera GM has on SuperCruise. The next best solution is a touch pressure sensor built into the steering wheel. The least effective is the steering wheel torque/input method--which is what Tesla uses and it seems like the i-pace might as well.

My F-Pace has a driver fatigue monitoring system built in, but I think that just uses steering wheel inputs to determine and in 2.5 years of ownership I've never had it go off--I'm far too anal to not have my hands on the steering wheel. But it uses the coffee cup icon just like in this test as well.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
94 Posts
The next best solution is a touch pressure sensor built into the steering wheel. The least effective is the steering wheel torque/input method--which is what Tesla uses and it seems like the i-pace might as well.
In another thread I posted this:
I sent my salesman with a list of technical questions to his recent I-Pace training in Southern California.

The I-Pace is using capacitive touch. However, the sensors are only at the "10" and "2" positions on the steering wheel.
n
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
112 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
I ordered autosteer ... the technology is just too primitive and too unsafe at this time. That goes for Tesla as well as Jaguar and all the others.
FWIW I use Tesla AutoPilot all the time on dual-carriageway. It is far less tiring on long drives than manual driving (even with TACC). I didn't believe it until I owned it myself. Always have a hand on the wheel though, but in 2 years of driving I haven't had a scary moment and my view is that if either AP or me reacts to a problem that's better than just me (e.g. AP uses radar under car in front to detect that car in front of that is braking, and also moves over if side-intrusion from adjacent lane is detected; probably a bunch of other things too)

I would also say (but may well "just be me" :) ) that setting AP to a suitable safe-follow-distance and then having it maintain that is better than me pushing up behind people to encourage them to move over. Much more, than before, I just let the car sit there at safe distance; that might contribute to reduction in tiredness. Of course I could have done that in previous vehicles that just had TACC, but I didn't. TACC in previous vehicles has not been able to come to a stop (e.g. stop-start traffic) so significant slowing of traffic required manual intervention. Not sure what change in Tech would have been enough for me to say "just get on with it" ... so maybe that is only AP-related, in my case, because it is the first car I've owned where I have changed my attitude.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,494 Posts
I had a chance to drive the GM Super Cruise. Not sure what I'd use it for but it works excellent. Most likely it would be a safety system for me. A redundant steering control. But many (most?) drivers want the autosteering to be the primary driver and the human to be the fallback. Pokemon, Angry Birds, or Twitbookgram ain't going to play themselves while you're supposed to be driving!!! Besides last night's Grey's Anatomy might have been interesting. OK, perhaps at best a 10% possibility, but you should watch it in heavy traffic with bicycles, motorcycles, and pedestrians just to be sure. You have insurance.

Odd thing about Adaptive Cruise Control (Tesla Automatic Car Coordination?) is that it harms your range. An educated foot will get you more range. This has been true since the first Cruise Controls were vacuum operated and mechanically pushed the pedal down, but is more true with EVs.

With me it's about 6% difference (6 miles per 100 miles) when ACC is set to max range (3 seconds). This is only important in a pinch, but you should practice before you need it. The goal is to keep the peak kW numbers as low as possible, both accel and decel. Charging and discharging a battery lose power in a non-linear fashion. Heat increases resistance which creates heat which creates more resistance.
 
  • Like
Reactions: I-PaceDave

·
Registered
Joined
·
112 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
The first TACC I had was in a VW and its modus operandi was to "maintain speed until almost on the tail of car in front and then jump on the brakes". Utterly-non-Eco (and that was in their BlueMotion Eco model ...) and very alarming for a passenger.

Tesla AP does not use up some of the available safe-follow-distance to slow down gently (i.e. only using regen) as a human would, so I expect you are right on range ...

... although it definitely does a better job than my wife who is constantly on/off the gas pedal on highway ... so @McRat I think your theory only holds good for Perfect Drivers, like you and me :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,494 Posts
The first TACC I had was in a VW and its modus operandi was to "maintain speed until almost on the tail of car in front and then jump on the brakes". Utterly-non-Eco (and that was in their BlueMotion Eco model ...) and very alarming for a passenger.

Tesla AP does not use up some of the available safe-follow-distance to slow down gently (i.e. only using regen) as a human would, so I expect you are right on range ...

... although it definitely does a better job than my wife who is constantly on/off the gas pedal on highway ... so @McRat I think your theory only holds good for Perfect Drivers, like you and me :)
Yeah, a spastic foot is worse than ACC.
ACC is in the middle.
Calm foot is the winner.

My wife and daughter are the same. They both have lead feet. If they drive an EV for a couple days, the rated range drops.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
560 Posts
Sometimes, I think Tesla drivers do not really ENJOY "DRIVING." They would rather be passengers. It's so the opposite of VW's campaign slogan way back when, "Drivers Wanted."
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
112 Posts
Discussion Starter #14
Sometimes, I think Tesla drivers do not really ENJOY "DRIVING." They would rather be passengers.
You may be right, I resemble that comment :) might just be that I am getting old ...

I regard myself as a keen driver, I have an half-ton, V8, 300 BHP "toy" in the garage. Haven't driven it, not once, since owning Tesla. They are both low 3s 0-60, but the Tesla is a whole pile more useful. And 90% of my driving is highway, so just engage AutoPilot and keep a good lookout. No ear-ache, head-fuzzy, from that blarring exhause noise ...

As soon as the thing will, reliably [insert your prediction here!] drive itself I'm happy. I can use the journey time FAR better than actually having to drive.

I have one "kid" who has been driving for a handful of years, and another that has been of-age to drive for a couple but would prefer to wait for self-driving to happen ...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
112 Posts
That's because so much of what we do, isn't driving.
Driving is a Model S P100D on a back road with zero traffic and no cops around that winds up and down hill with sweeping turns and a few hairpins.


However, driving bumper to bumper at 50 or stop and go and stop and go and stop and go isn't driving. That's when Auto Pilot saves the day...
Or a 2 hour drive on the highway with cops everywhere. AP FTW. you arrive with SO much more energy and less stress.

We drive my wife's 3 roughly 300 miles/weekend in the summer (if not more) and 95% is on AP... I'd be hard pressed to give that up, knowing the improvements that occur automatically for it... I still plan to go drool over the ipace, but without AP, it's just lacking. While I'm a car guy, I'm also a tech guy, and Tesla has the tech.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
309 Posts
However, driving bumper to bumper at 50 or stop and go and stop and go and stop and go isn't driving. That's when Auto Pilot saves the day...
Or a 2 hour drive on the highway with cops everywhere. AP FTW. you arrive with SO much more energy and less stress.
Which part of Autopilot provides these benefits - the adaptive cruise control or the autosteer?

I assume it's the ACC, and that any car with decent ACC would provide similar stress relief, same as the Teslas. But I would welcome info from anyone more knowledgeable than I.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
112 Posts
Discussion Starter #17
Which part of Autopilot provides these benefits
I had Traffic Aware Cruise Control (never know if it is TAFF or ACC - the sort that uses forward facing e.g. Radar and slows down when approaching a slower car) on previous car (i.e. before Tesla). Didn't notice any reduce in fatigue on long journeys compared to previous non-adaptive Cruise Control or just "no cruise control" manual driving.

On Tesla with both TACC and stay-in-lane [i.e. AutoPilot] (and possibly signal-to-change-lanes, but I doubt that is relevant!!) that's when I noted the reduction in fatigue.

Mine is only one data-point though - but I've read many drivers saying the same thing, but I don't know if they, too, previously found no improvement with just-TACC
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
112 Posts
We pretty much always use full auto pilot, including auto steer. Nothing ticks me off more than manual cruise because no one else in the world seems to use it. You set a speed and catch up/pass people, then they pass you, then you get right up on them because they slowed down. it's infuriating.



Adaptive Cruise - how Tesla has done it, where it can be turned on any time you are not on the brake (0mph), and brings the car to a full stop, and starts going again is great it's 65% stress reduction right there.


The Auto Steer is another 25% reduction. However the constant nags are now stress inducing. AP is significantly smoother in turns than my wife jerking the wheel. She's never got the whole turn in smoothly hold, turn out thing. She handles the wheel as on/off. Not good for one's stomach in a vehicle w/tight steering.


I can set AP to an appropriate MPH at a distance of 3-4 and just let 'r rip. for 80+ miles at a time. Never gets tired, never gets distracted, never gets road rage.

I still want to like the Jag, I like the looks, I like the price point, I like the performance, and never thought AP would be a deciding factor buying a car... but man is it sweet. I keep trying to talk myself into.. well... the wife's car has AP and super charging so... maybe I don't need it then...


I'll call the Jag dealer next week, they told me Sept to have one in the showroom... Also I get to keep saying "Shaguwar" when talking to my wife, and that's just hilarious. Ok, she hates me, but I find it funny as ****.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
309 Posts
I still want to like the Jag, I like the looks, I like the price point, I like the performance, and never thought AP would be a deciding factor buying a car... but man is it sweet.
The Engadget reviewer (quoted below) has apparently driven Tesla and Nissan's autopilots, as well as the I-Pace, and he says the Jaguar AP performs comparably. Jaguar does lack auto lane changes, but that does not seem to be a big part of the relaxation you get from AP anyway; I suspect auto lane changes would greatly increase my stress level, at least until the tech advances considerably.

Perhaps AP is not a differentiator between Tesla and Jaguar anymore?

Engadget: "When you do get onto that freeway, the adaptive cruise control and steering assist do a fine job keeping the vehicle in its lane and tracking the cars in front of it. It's not as robust as Autopilot found on the Model X though. It doesn't have auto lane change, but its ability to track the road is nearly on par with Tesla's and Nissan's offerings."
 
1 - 20 of 39 Posts
Top