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Help! My battery may be bad

14K views 57 replies 13 participants last post by  wuxyjj@yahoo.com 
#1 ·
Not sure what to do. I just bought an I pace on sunday Nov 10. After charging it overnight in my chargepoint home charger, I can only get it to 91% charge (183 mile range) even though the left side of the screen says charging complete. My dealer has given me a loaner while they try to fix this issue, but after reading all the posts on faulty batteries I am really worried. I cant believe that they didn't figure this out before letting me drive the car home. Any thoughts or suggestions?
thanks,
jon
 
#2 ·
Sorry to hear this. Is this a brand new vehicle, and what was the build date? Or was it pre-owned?
If you have a loaner, I suggest some patience initially to let them figure out what's wrong. Just be persistent with seeking answers. Insist on a specific technical explanation for what's wrong, not just some handwaving.
 
#3 ·
thanks for the advice. Yes this was a new 2019 vehicle that had 700 miles (I assume from customer test drives). not sure the build date. Otherwise I absolutely love the car, never driven anything like it. I am hoping that since the vehicle only shows 91% charge and otherwise seems to drive normally they can figure out how to get a full 100% charge.
 
#6 ·
Sorry to hear you also have a battery issue. Maybe it's software in your case? I'm not sure if that is better or worse.

Have you triple checked that you'll be eligible for the tax rebate? I was looking at an iPace with a few hundred miles on it and there was some question over whether it's eligible as a new EV purchase. The leasing company claimed it would not be and I think it depends on how/if they registered it and what the use was.
 
#5 ·
The build date will show up on the repair order form (at least it does here).

Never make assumptions. I always ask about the mileage on it before purchase. Is it a demo car? Was it used as a courtesy car for local function (e.g. golf tournament)? Courtesy car (loaner) for the dealer? etc. This probably isn't necessary if it has only a few miles on it.

Good luck with them sorting this out.
 
#7 ·
Main battery replaced at 10,000 kms. New battery required repair of 2 of 6 charge control modules. New batter would charge to only 91% and required new software. New battery shows 94% health on WattCat which is worrisome after 1000kms.
[I thought I'd respond to this here to keep the battery poll thread mostly a poll instead of discussion]

What capacity does WattCat show for your new battery?
 
#11 ·
Wattcatt data:

Nov 11th:

81% charge - 55.55 kW
100% charge - 69.44 kW
That is 77.15% of the base capacity of 90 kW
Or 82.67% of the base capacity of 84 kW

Nov 11th

75% charge - 51.45 kW
100% charge - 68.01 kW
That is 75.57% of the base capacity of 90 kW
Or 81.66% of the base capacity of 84 kW

Nov 12th

68% charge - 46.25 kW
100% charge - 68.6 kW
That is 76.22% of the base capacity of 90 kW
Or 81% of the base capacity of 84 kW

Nov 12th

60% charge - 38.4 kW
100% charge - 64 kW
That is 71.11% of the base capacity of 90 kW
Or 76.19% of the base capacity of 84 kW

Nov 14th

93% charge - 63.85 kW
100% charge - 68.65 kW
That is 76.28% of the base capacity of 90 kW
Or 81.73% of the base capacity of 84 kW

Nov 14th

96% charge - 66.1 kW
100% charge - 68.85 kW
That is 76.5% of the base capacity of 90 kW
Or 81.96% of the base capacity of 84 kW

I have some serious concerns about the health of my battery.

The vehicle suffered from coolant leakage for the first 5 or 6 months. I didn't use the AC because it was winter. When I realized the AC wasn't working, I gave my vehicle for repair and Jaguar took 3 weeks for repair.

I am concerned that the battery pack may have some suffered damage during this time because of impaired thermal management.

If the data that Wattcat is showing is anywhere close to being correct, the degree of degradation my battery pack has suffered, is unacceptable.
 
#13 ·
From my experience so far, there could be two items wrong. Your main battery could be bad, but it might be something less bad as I have received both fixes.

The first time my battery would only charge up to around 86% then say ‘Charge Complete’ After they replaced my battery, within a thousand KMs or so I had a ‘Main Batter Fault’ and I couldn’t operate the vehicle. By morning it cleared up and I could drive it to the dealer. It turns out there are 6 modules (possibly called charge controllers, or thermal management controllers or something like that) and they make sure that the battery is cooled or warmed correctly and that the cells are receiving the same charge. 2 of the 6 in the car needed to be replaced.

After they fixed that, I got my car back but it would only charge up to 91% then say ‘Charge Complete’ again. It turns out that there was a software update and the software for the Chinese market was loaded inadvertently during the previous repair. They couldn’t figure out how to upload the Canadian software so Jaguar Head Office remotely operated their computer and updated my car properly and I can now charge back to 100%

Now I wonder if all along I just had bad software and did they have to change the battery originally? I have no way of knowing. Anyhow, the battery replacement is actually just a couple hour job once they receive it. I think that is your issue and I don’t think they will debate you too hard on your lack of battery capacity
 
#14 ·
Thanks Varun for posting this! [I moved your post here to keep the poll thread a poll of sorts]

I also suspect a bad battery pack in Varun's case.

In my case, JLR had the dealer do a deep dive into the battery cells and instructed the dealer to take apart the battery and replace individual cells. [Needless to say I'm not excited about that]

Timbo, did they actually replace the whole pack for you?
 
#17 ·
So I just heard back from the dealer, they identified a software issue that was blocking 4 cells from charging. They tell me it is fixed and the car is charging to 100%. They are still trying to get the range corrected to state 240 miles, as currently it is only stating 200...I’ll keep you posted
 
#18 ·
If you don't yet have an android device or can't use a friend's for WattCat, I suggest you insist on them telling you how many kWh the API shows (or the measurement via the OBD port). They can get that information. It should be about 82kWh - 84 kWh with a full charge. Don't let them fool you with the GoM or the idea that 100% SoC indicates a good battery.

It would be a weird software flaw that surfaces only on some vehicles. If you can extract more information from them that would be helpful for us.
 
#20 ·
Haha, no worries! Maybe we should make this a sticky:

API = Application Programming Interface. It's the "portal" that lets mobile devices communicate with a database. All your drive- and vehicle-related data are uploaded to a database at JLR (unless you didn't register your car with them) and mobile apps and web interfaces that you use interact with these databases via the API. So, "API" is actually a bit of a misnomer, because it's just an intermediary; "Database" would be the better term. Either way, we mean information stored on the JLR servers that you can access via your device.

OBD = On-board diagnostics. A protocol that lets third parties communicate with the information that is stored in the car and change parameters of running the car. There's a port in the driver's footwell that's for the connection of an OBD device; and then you have an app that communicates with *that* device. More fine-grained information, because not everything gets reported to the database; and a direct way (*the* way in fact) to change low-level parameters of how the car actually runs.

GoM = Guess-o-Meter. The range indicator. That's your 201 or 234 or 280 or whatever miles the car tells you it thinks you have. Based on (1) equal parts magic and (2) calculations of your past behavior and (3) bugs. Every EV has one.

SoC = State of Charge; the percentage of your battery's capacity that's still available. Your gas gauge (although it's not quite as direct of a measurement as the gas volume in an ICE car (ICE = Internal Combustion Engine)

HTH
 
#21 ·
Thanks so much, Super Helpful!!! I wonder if my GoM was low (around 301miles) because it recalculated based on my driving behavior? Even though I only had the car for 48 hrs, I did a lot of driving in Dynamic mode...I just couldn't help myself. It appears that this can be reset to factory settings by depressing brake and gas pedals simultaneously for 10 second...? Hopefully my mechanics can figure all this out. I will make sure I don't take delivery of my car unless kWh is at least 84. Thanks again for all the help, I will post again when I find out more information.
 
#26 ·
Aha, maybe they learned that telling the dealer to fix individual battery cells is idiotic. Case in point: by the time mine is fixed it will have been almost three months at the dealer, triggering a super ripe and yellow lemon law. Not in their interest ... or in anyone's interest except perhaps the dealer's, who is generating revenue with the service.
 
#31 ·
While it is a major component from a cost perspective, swapping out the battery is really a simple affair. Aside from waiting for the battery to arrive, the actual replacement is only a couple hours work along with some tests that makes the entire process around 2 days. I agree that a ‘heart replacement’ of an internal combustion engine is significant with all the plumbing and electric swapping required, the battery is just a couple connectors and cooling circuits. I was able to watch them replace mine and was shocked (pardon the pun) at the simplicity of the operation. Less like a pacemaker being inserted and more like having a wart removed. Granted, not a great analogy, but I certainly don’t feel like the heart of the vehicle has been swapped.
 

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#32 ·
I know it is a relatively simple process, but still, if my car was only a few months old with a few thousand miles, I still would rather just swap cars.

Not too long ago I watched a video of a Model S converted from a P75 to a P90 within a matter of a few hours, which included the necessary software updates.
 
#33 ·
I think I am leaning towards letting them replace the battery and see how the car runs. Hopefully I will still be protected by the warranty. I am planning to speak with the manager of the dealership and try to get his assurance that if the new battery doesn’t fix my issue he would give me a full refund or a new I pace...I am not willing to have any more major repairs on a new car...
 
#36 ·
I agree with many of the recent posts. Just briefly observing: If the car killed the battery, the death of battery #2 would likely provide pretty strong evidence; in which case there'd be a pretty solid lemon law case. So, either way, the matter will get sorted. With the battery apparently retailing at $60k, there is a good financial argument that battery = car; while in materials terms it is arguable that the battery is not equivalent to the entire car. . . . With the ultimate aim being "possession of a properly functioning car," again, it all gets resolved either way.
 
#38 ·
I have a very similar case, new car purchased October 28th, bad battery, still with dealer since November 12th, keep getting told that will be fixed by the end of the week, not sure which week. ( last i hear 2 week ago was that 3 cells needed replacement..)

sound very similar, new car with 748 miles on it, ( turns out mine was in dealer for about a year before I got it looking at some of the paperwork in the car).

perhaps all these cars with bad batteries are part of a series built at same time, if so i would have expected Jaguar to identify the issue and resolve it before their reputation goes completely sour
 
#39 ·
Sounds like the same issue for sure. I had a very candid discussion with the manager who agreed that if my battery replacement doesn't fix the issue, or if any other issues occur, he will talk to JLR and open a case to get a replacement car. The good news is that we should be protected by the warranty, but obviously that has to be backed up by the dealer and JLR...
We should compare build dates...
 
#40 ·
We should compare build dates...
A few of us shared build dates and they were months apart. Mine is March 2019.

My guess is it's an issue with how the battery is integrated. The battery manufacturer has a pretty good reputation and has to be testing these things before sending them to JLR. I'd wager the car is improperly safeguarding the battery under certain circumstances.. for many of us that's the time it sat at a dealer unused. One person mentioned a prolonged coolant issue (prolonged because JLR dealerships took forever to fix it) before the battery went bad. It would also explain why no warnings are showing up, because the car's software is inadequately monitoring the battery.

Just a theory, though.
 
#42 ·
so they just delivered my I pace with a new battery. I have been following along on my app over the last few days as it has successfully charged to 100% and 242 mile range. Service department manager personally delivered the car, and then spent over an hour dialing it in. After a month with a loaner land rover I realize how sweet this car really is. Hopefully no more issues!!
 
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