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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I have a big problem. My 2019 iPace is sort of dead. My JLR dealer can't work on it right now since their iPace qualified techs are out on COVID.

Right now, WattCat shows my TCU battery at 0%!

Here is what happenned:
1) I started getting the traction battery fault warning, but the car was operating fine. I called my dealer to schedule service, but got delayed due to another unrelated door lock problem (another story!).
2) I needed to move my car from the garage where the charger is and parked it without the charger plugged up. 7 days later, I tried to move it and got all kinds of errors, including the mushy brakes. The car would not engage D, R, or N. P started to blinlk.
3) I still had 108 miles left on the main battery.
4) I found an extension cord and hooked up the Level 1 charger. It wouldn't charge and the indicator flashed red.
5) I found the bypass to pop the frunk and accessed the 12V batteries.
6) The larger 12V battery registered just 4 volts!
7) I hooked up a regular 12V charger and waited. Once the voltage got up on the larger 12V battery, I disconnected the 12V charger and tried to connect the regular Level 1 charger. The car accepted it and started charging the main battery.
8) I waited a couple of days and tried to move the car again. The car would not engage D, R, or N. P started to blink. The dash shut down after a few seconds.
9) I checked WattCat and found my TCU battery at 0%.

What does TCU battery at 0% mean?

And what about the smaller battery? Right now, it is just showing 3.5V. Should I hook up a 12V charger to the smaller battery??

In the meantime, my JLR dealer isn't ready to accept the car for work since they have techs out on COVID...

Any ideas???
 

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Sorry about your misery, Jammin. A number of people have had faulty 12V batteries that required replacement. Once the new battery was installed everything worked fine. It sounds like there might be a drain somewhere including the TCU battery but I don't want to diagnose anything.

Charging the car should also charge the 12V and TCU. If it doesn't then try to charge the 12V and once it's over 12.6V try to start the car. Running the car also charges both batteries. If that fails then it's a trip to the dealer. Maybe they can give you a loaner while you're waiting?

Good luck and keep us posted.
 

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Yes, charge the smaller battery 12V battery until completely charged. Leave the level 1 charger charging the car too while charging the 12V battery.
WattCat shows the voltage of the auxiliary battery (smaller 12V battery). What does it show? Was it 3.5V via a meter or the WattCat display?

As I posted in another thread, the TCU has an internal battery. It is a unit with two batteries in it. One is supposed to last for 10 years and the other is rechargeable. The rechargeable battery is the main battery used by the TCU. That part has apparently gone to 0%. The non-chargeable part apparently has a charge or WattCat would not be able to show you current information.

If the larger battery went flat again after your attempt to start it, it should be recharged to full. Possibly take it out and take it to the dealer to have it tested/replaced. Let them work out the paperwork later once they are able to service the car. Based on #1 I suspect the battery is defective or you need a programming update for the BCCM and/or BECM.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Update. I used a 12V charger on both 12V batteries under the hood and finally got the car to turn on and drive it around the block. Then, I charged it overnight with my 20A 240V main charger. I drove it around the block again. I parked it last night and left if OFF the charger to see if it can survive. When I go out later today, I'll see if it works. If so, I'll drive it around town and then use the meter to test the two 12V batteries. The odd part about all of this is that WattCat still shows 0% on TCU. I'll post another update if I get it running around town enough to consider it OK. Either way, it will make it's way back to the dealer for a full diagnosis and annual checkup. I need them to fix another issue with my door lock anyway. I just want to be able to DRIVE it to the dealer instead of getting a tow!

Another thing to mention and this is important: when I tried to charge the larger 12V battery using my super low power battery conditioner, I was not able to charge it. Everytime it built up enough, some systems would turn on and drain the battery faster than the conditioner could charge. I knew this was happenning because I could hear things click on and I could hear fluid circulating. So, I had to remove the battery conditioner and use a regular 12V charger on the 2 amp setting. Even at 2 amps, it hummed like it was working hard which is not surprising given how low the voltage was. The 2 amp charge seemed to work and built up enough to outrun the systems that were turning on. (I didn't want to use the 10 amp setting because it was humming so much at just 2 amps.)

Another lesson I think I learned is that if the 12V system gets too low, the cat cannot wake up enough to start charging from the traction battery. I think there is a significant design flaw that doesn't let the cat know when to use the DC-DC converter to pull a charge from the traction battery when the car is parked and off. It seems to only do that when the car is turned on or if successfully plugged in to the charger. I couldn't trick it into doing this because with the 12V system so low because it would not even allow the Level 1 charger to connect (it flashed red). I'm willing to bet this could be fixed in software to periodically wake up and check levels so the DC-DC converter could turn on to keep things charged. Bear in mind that this problem happenned after being parked for a mere 7 days without being connected to the charger. I probably have something wrong to make the 12V drain so fast, but the issue could have still been resolved if the cat could wake up and check levels and activate the DC-DC charger. Even if JLR doesn't fix it in software, it would be great if there was a way to manually switch the DC-DC converter on. I truly belive there is a design flaw somewhere that should be addressed.

I'll post another update soon.
 

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I've had mine sleep for a long time and did not experience the 12V batteries going flat. There has to be something about yours (e.g. defective 12V battery/ies like we've seen in others).

If a person only has a low amp charger available, disconnect the car's negative connection to the battery and then charge it.
The 10A setting might have been the better choice. Other electronics and electrical devices will come back to life. The alarm system & door locks are such things. A charger with a higher amperage would be even better at charging the battery/ies quicker.

I have "intelligent'' chargers that can start at high amps and fade down to off when "full". Even some inexpensive ones from Harbor Freight have this feature these days. They even have settings or auto detect an AGM or flooded battery type. The small battery in the cat is AGM and the large battery is flooded (even though Jaguar advertised it as AGM).

I also have a non-intelligent, old charger available that has come in handy. Sometimes the intelligent chargers will not start charging a flat battery. The dumb one will start charging it. After a while, I'll disconnect it and check that an intelligent charger will work. If it won't charge the patient then the time is called and death is declared.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Update. I drove the car around town today after letting it sit UNPLUGGED overnight. Everything seemed fine except my driver side window won't do an auto-up when closing. It can do an auto-down, but not an auto-up. The passenger side still does a full auto close when raising. That's weird and it's a new problem that didn't exist before... Anyone else have a
problem with the auto-up??
I put a power meter on the 12V batteries when I got home. Both of the 12V batteries are in the 14.4 - 14.8V range when I tested. A few hours later, WattCat now reports 13.1V on the aux battery and I finally see something higher than 0% on the TCU battery - it's showing as 10% in WattCat. That 10% number still has me worried and convinced there is an underlying 12V system problem.

I put everything back together and stowed an extension cord and 12V charger in the frunk. Next, I'll schedule a visit to the dealer.

I agree with Ayepace that there is still something wrong in the 12V system somewhere. At least I can deal with it now so it's not dead in the water. And I really like Ayepace's suggestion to disconnect the negative before charging to keep from competing with the systems turning on. It's pretty tight up in the battery area, so additional disassembly of the shrouds may be required.

Another thing to mention is that my "traction battery fault" message has disappeared. That was the error I had received about a week before the cat died. I'm sure this is all related in some fashion. It's just weird to get a fault from the traction battery and then have problems on the 12V side. I wish I could see more diagnostic info from the error messages!

Now for a stupid question. I don't know much about modern car repair and stopped fiddling with cars when they got complicated years ago. The last time I worked on a car was 25 years ago when I changed the water pump on a 1980 XJ6 (a beautiful car that I wish I kept). I'm an IT guy and I understand AC and DC electrical very well, but I don't know anything about modern car systems. Is there a way to grab all the logs from an iPace and read through them? I saw in some notes from another repair at the dealer that the tech downloaded log files and sent to JLR for an open case. Is there any way we can see that kind of data???
 

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Reset auto-up by lowering the window all the way down, then lift the switch and hold it as the window raises all the way up. Continue to hold the switch up for at least 2 seconds.
Auto-up will be reset at that time. This is a procedure that needs to be done anytime the large 12V battery is disconnected (or loses charge). Repeat for all windows as necessary.

The UK member that had the TCU battery go to 0% reported it took a few days of normal driving for it to return to full charge (90% reported in WattCat).

The side "shroud" is easy enough to pull loose. Remove the small rectangular panel in it near the front. Put your fingers in it along the fender (wing) side and pull straight up. Grasp the rear of the panel along the fender (wing) and pull straight up. Now you can rotate the panel out of the way. To remove it completely requires supporting the hood (bonnet), disconnecting the support strut and then slide the "shroud" over the struts loose end. The shroud hooks onto the front panel so move it towards the back of the engine compartment a little to disengage it before rotating.

"Installation is the reverse of removal."

Getting the same data requires Pathfinder and a subscription with JLR. It's a bit pricey. I haven't found anyone who has developed a similar interface to retrieve all the data.

A "traction battery fault" is misleading for a 12V battery problem. Search of the forums will find this noted upon several occasions.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Reset auto-up by lowering the window all the way down, then lift the switch and hold it as the window raises all the way up. Continue to hold the switch up for at least 2 seconds.
Auto-up will be reset at that time. This is a procedure that needs to be done anytime the large 12V battery is disconnected (or loses charge). Repeat for all windows as necessary.

The UK member that had the TCU battery go to 0% reported it took a few days of normal driving for it to return to full charge (90% reported in WattCat).

The side "shroud" is easy enough to pull loose. Remove the small rectangular panel in it near the front. Put your fingers in it along the fender (wing) side and pull straight up. Grasp the rear of the panel along the fender (wing) and pull straight up. Now you can rotate the panel out of the way. To remove it completely requires supporting the hood (bonnet), disconnecting the support strut and then slide the "shroud" over the struts loose end. The shroud hooks onto the front panel so move it towards the back of the engine compartment a little to disengage it before rotating.

"Installation is the reverse of removal."

Getting the same data requires Pathfinder and a subscription with JLR. It's a bit pricey. I haven't found anyone who has developed a similar interface to retrieve all the data.

A "traction battery fault" is misleading for a 12V battery problem. Search of the forums will find this noted upon several occasions.
Thanks for the fix on the auto-up. Three of the four windows had to be reset and your fix worked perfectly. It also saved me from looking like a dummy on my next visit to the dealer.
 

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With regards to the TCU battery, the only way to increase the charge of that is to drive there car! It took me several days to get the charge from 0 to 90%
 

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I suppose it was a matter of time for my 12v to go. Tried to leave the Home Depot. Started the car (board was green, no errors), touched R, the backup cam came on, the backup beeping started. Touch the accelerator and nothing. Put it in D, touch the accelerator, nothing. Looked 100% normal otherwise. Tried stopping and starting up again a few times and nothing. Eventually the battery charge failure came on and I knew what I was getting into. Eventually all sorts of errors came up, then it all shut down (mostly). Wired quickly blinking hazards are going and the rear hatch lock won’t stop cycling (hundreds of times). Kind of the electronic version of transient delirium (when the brain is not getting enough oxygen).

Called roadside assistance and waiting for the tow. Had the good sense to pop the hood while there was enough power but the windows are open a bit. Hope we don’t get rain until tomorrow!
 

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Hope this gets sorted out quickly. I had to replace my 12v battery after I got the ok to drive with caution, brake pedal feel reduced error. No explanation as to why the battery failed.

Too bad there's no early warning on these. On an ICE car I found i hear the starter struggling several weeks before and would know the battery needed replacing.
 

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Aw bummer. How many miles, and how much had you been driving it recently? Is there an explanation or did it just happen out of the blue when it shouldn't have?
Best of luck, thanks to this forum you were mentally prepared! I hope it doesn't happen to me on a road trip ...
 

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I am at 35k km. I did have an issue charging a couple of weeks ago where it stopped charging overnight and when I plugged it back in, it would charge a small amount then switch to initializing. I assumed it was the charger (I’ve had the unit replaced twice) and used the 120v charger one night then back to the L2 and it has been fine ever since. I’ve had a longstanding FOB issue and a ghost operating the rear hatch (rare, but weird opening and closing of the rear hatch when I stand next to it for a while, or leaning inside). Might be related to the 12v I suppose.

I do mostly 20-30 min drives to/from work but did a 600km trip a couple of weeks ago without a hiccup.

The tow arrived and he boosted the 12v and the car started and I was able to drive it onto the flatbed, but I was ready to use the transmission release. I’ll check with the dealer in the morning.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
rcomeau: Tell me about your longstanding FOB issue. I'm wondering if it is similar to the keyfob issue I continue to have. Frequently, I cannot use the button on the door handle to unlock the car, but I have to pull the keyfob out and unlock using the button on the keyfob (or I can use my phone). But, I can always use the button on the door handle to lock the car. It's only unlocking that acts up. I am convinced there is a correlation to my 12V system because the problem went away for a long time AFTER I changed the 12v battery, but eventually started happenning again. The weird part is that is ONLY affects UNLOCKING and NEVER affects locking. So that tells me the keyfob proximity sensing is actually working.
 

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I think my issue is similar to yours. If the FOB is in my pocket, the button on the door handle does not work (any door). I was able to figure out that the FOB needed to be able the window line to work. So if I held the FOB in my hand at pocket height, nothing. If i raised it slowly and kept pushing the door button, it would eventually (and reliably) work then the height crossed the window line. I was sure I had tested it with both FOBS, but the dealer was (after a couple of weeks "investigating" determined that it was a faulty FOB. The other FOB works properly so they ordered a new FOB, which co-incidentally arrived today, so they will replace the FOB after they fix the 12v battery. Of course, the battery seems fine now that the tow driver boosted it, but they will look at the battery in detail when the tech is available. I made a video of it here : KeyFob.m4v .

I'll report back to see if the FOB replacement works, but I suspect the car in general has poor grounding which might make some of the electronics less reliable, like my phantom rear hatch issue.

Cheers,

Roch
 

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Just a final (hopefully) update. They confirmed the battery was not being charged properly and did updates to the BCCM, BECM, and GWM modules. They did a long road test and seem to think it was been resolved. I'll update if this is not the case.
 

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I'm not what they mean when they say updates - is that software or did they replace a module. If it's just software, what caused it to suddenly not work properly? Can car software get 'corrupted' like windows registry. I'm not a programmer so I don't quite understand what's happening when they say they fixed a problem with an update.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
rcomeau: I have another question about your keyfob issue. You described the problem with the button on the door not UNLOCKING unless you raised the fob near the door in a certain manner. My new question is about locking the door. Did the button on the door consistently work correctly when locking when the keyfob remained in your pocket?
 
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