[Glenn23]

For owners in the US - is a class action necessary?

According to the latest recall letter:

"This notice is sent to you in accordance with the National Traffic and Motor Vehicle Safety Act. Jaguar has decided that a defect which relates to motor vehicle safety exists in certain 2019 model year Jaguar I-PACE vehicles."

According to the NHTSA "Motor Vehicle Safety Defects and Recalls" brochure:

"Once a safety-defect determination is made, the law gives the manufacturer three options for correcting the defect: repair, replacement, or refund. In the case of a vehicle recall, the manufacturer may choose to repair the vehicle at no charge; replace the vehicle with an identical or similar vehicle; or refund the purchase price in full, minus a reasonable allowance for depreciation."

It seems to me that the final remedy FOR JAGUAR is "...to address this safety issue, we will work with you to arrange the re-purchase of your vehicle from you, less depreciation based on the age, condition and mileage of your vehicle."

But according to the NHTSA - it's either FIX the problem, REFUND full purchase price minus a reasonable depreciation allowance, or REPLACE the vehicle.

So it seems that it would be less cost for Jaguar to offer to repurchase the vehicle at KBB pricing (JLR offer) and have owners agree to that, than to refund the full purchase price minus depreciation (US law) - since replacement or fixing don't seem to be options at this time.

Am I missing something here?

 

[epirali]

Is full purchase price minus depreciation same as market value?

 

[Glenn23]

Is full purchase price minus depreciation same as market value?

I don't think so - since Jaguar isn't asking us for the purchase price of the vehicle when calculating the repurchase value. According to "Thunder Said Energy" (Vehicle depreciation rates: EVs versus ICEs? - Thunder Said Energy.) the depreciation for EV's in $0.27/mi. I "think" lemon law claims use full purchase price minus depreciation based on mileage (how much the vehicle has been used) - which makes sense to me. The market value is a synthetic calculation based on what people are wiling to pay for the vehicle - and now that the I-Pace is shown to have a safety defect, that number is significantly less. And I don't think the original purchaser should be penalized with market value when the safety defect is the cause of the reduced value. I think it's more fair to use the original purchase price minus depreciation based on mileage in this situation.

 

[jfinley]

Per @Glenn23 - link: https://www.nhtsa.gov/sites/nhtsa.gov/files/documents/mvdefectsandrecalls_808795.pdf

";or refund the purchase price in full, minus a reasonable allowance for depreciation." That said, reviewing - KBB, it's VERY low e.g. 20k. GO to Caravana for same model/year and it's$30k (retail).

Exactly what is "reasonable". I've been without a car now over a month - blocking my garage, etc. Ive consulted counsel but unsure what to do - want to rid myself of this thing once and for all.

 

[Glenn23]

Per @Glenn23 - link: https://www.nhtsa.gov/sites/nhtsa.gov/files/documents/mvdefectsandrecalls_808795.pdf

";or refund the purchase price in full, minus a reasonable allowance for depreciation." That said, reviewing - KBB, it's VERY low e.g. 20k. GO to Caravana for same model/year and it's$30k (retail).

Exactly what is "reasonable". I've been without a car now over a month - blocking my garage, etc. Ive consulted counsel but unsure what to do - want to rid myself of this thing once and for all.

I think "reasonable" in this situation (safety issue where manufacturer is stating that the vehicle is not suitable for everyday use) would be market value (at the time of purchase = full purchase price) minus reasonable depreciation (depreciation: a reduction in the value of an asset with the passage of time, due in particular to wear and tear).

Since the current buyback offer does not ask for full purchase price, condition, or current milage, I can only assume they are using some other method to value the vehicle which may or may not be reasonable. Based on a $0.27/mile depreciation rate, the owners can determine if their offer is reasonable or unreasonable (since only they know the condition of their vehicle and how much they paid).

These are just my thoughts - ultimately each owner will have to decide whether or not they want to participate in the current buyback program. I'm hoping that JLR is following the law and is an upstanding company that stands behind their cars. And that this current buyback option is to help owners get a quick resolution to the issue. And that after this optional buyback period is over, they will follow the NHTSA guidelines and either BUYBACK using full purchase price as the starting point or FIX the issue, or REPLACE the vehicle.

 

[jfinley]

I think "reasonable" in this situation (safety issue where manufacturer is stating that the vehicle is not suitable for everyday use) would be market value (at the time of purchase = full purchase price) minus reasonable depreciation (depreciation: a reduction in the value of an asset with the passage of time, due in particular to wear and tear).

Since the current buyback offer does not ask for full purchase price, condition, or current milage, I can only assume they are using some other method to value the vehicle which may or may not be reasonable. Based on a $0.27/mile depreciation rate, the owners can determine if their offer is reasonable or unreasonable (since only they know the condition of their vehicle and how much they paid).

These are just my thoughts - ultimately each owner will have to decide whether or not they want to participate in the current buyback program. I'm hoping that JLR is following the law and is an upstanding company that stands behind their cars. And that this current buyback option is to help owners get a quick resolution to the issue. And that after this optional buyback period is over, they will follow the NHTSA guidelines and either BUYBACK using full purchase price as the starting point or FIX the issue, or REPLACE the vehicle.

I asked the JLR Rep if they would FIX/REPAIR and the answer was no. I asked if there was an incentive for purchasing anything else in the JLR brand - no; buy back only.

 

[Glenn23]

I asked the JLR Rep if they would FIX/REPAIR and the answer was no. I asked if there was an incentive for purchasing anything else in the JLR brand - no; buy back only.

I think you're right - buyback will be the only option. However, I'm hoping this current voluntary buyback program (quicker) is a precursor to the NHTSA buyback required by law. I don't think using a generic "market value" as a starting point is the same as the NHTSA guideline of "full purchase price" - but I could be wrong.

 

[Lion Rampant]

Lots of good data and discussions on the Facebook Jaguar I-Pace 2019 H514/H539 Group Page. By the groups reckoning there is still hundreds of owners who aren't even in the queue for the buybacks yet.

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[jfinley]

Lots of good data and discussions on the Facebook Jaguar I-Pace 2019 H514/H539 Group Page. By the groups reckoning there is still hundreds of owners who aren't even in the queue for the buybacks yet.

Log into Facebook

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interestingly enough, perhaps they're watching this thread but was sent another offer slightly above initial without asking.

 

[Stephjag]

I just received a called for a buyback offer on Thursday. Do you think it’s wise to turn around & purchase the 2024?

 

[Jeffterry]

I would, the car is so great. Mine (MY19) is still fine but is an S and I would like the extras the other cars offer. Especially dynamic suspension.

 

[Glenn23]

I've decided to keep mine - it's paid for, still has an 8 year, 100,000 mile warranty on the battery, and it's been dependable (other than a few battery issues ). I'm perfectly capable of charging it to 80% with my home charger (7 hours overnight when less than 30mi on the battery), without the update (which my dealership can't do since there is a restriction on the vehicle). And it's just a great car to drive!!

 

[ipace_wanted]

I don't understand why you wouldn't sell it back and use the money to by a '22 model at no additional cost. You'll gain an extra 3 years of warranty and get the upgrades. Single 12V battery and better software.

 

[Glenn23]

I don't understand why you wouldn't sell it back and use the money to by a '22 model at no additional cost. You'll gain an extra 3 years of warranty and get the upgrades. Single 12V battery and better software.

I guess the main reason is that I can't find the paint I want (lighter color), the interior I want (not tan or red), and the features that I want (everything) in a `22 - I've only found 12 available. Same for a 2023 (7 available). I'd have to go to a 2024 - and by then the price is significantly over the buyback offer.

 

[ipace_wanted]

Here are a few that seem to meet the criteria...

Used 2022 Jaguar I-PACE For Sale at Jaguar Arrowhead | VIN: SADHD2S19N1621266

Used 2022 Jaguar I-PACE For Sale at Jaguar Arrowhead | VIN: SADHD2S13N1619187

Used 2022 Jaguar I-PACE For Sale at Jaguar Arrowhead | VIN: SADHD2S13N1622347

Used 2022 Jaguar I-PACE For Sale at Jaguar Hartford | VIN: SADHD2S19N1619355

Maybe I'm too pragmatic, but I would take an extra 3 years of warranty and fewer 12V battery issues over a specific interior color.

It's just unfathomable to me to turn down an offer that is $10,000 above current value. I'll post my story in a separate thread. Just waiting on my drop off appointment.

 

[Qtown charger]

Here are a few that seem to meet the criteria...

Used 2022 Jaguar I-PACE For Sale at Jaguar Arrowhead | VIN: SADHD2S19N1621266

Used 2022 Jaguar I-PACE For Sale at Jaguar Arrowhead | VIN: SADHD2S13N1619187

Used 2022 Jaguar I-PACE For Sale at Jaguar Arrowhead | VIN: SADHD2S13N1622347

Used 2022 Jaguar I-PACE For Sale at Jaguar Hartford | VIN: SADHD2S19N1619355

Maybe I'm too pragmatic, but I would take an extra 3 years of warranty and fewer 12V battery issues over a specific interior color.

It's just unfathomable to me to turn down an offer that is $10,000 above current value. I'll post my story in a separate thread. Just waiting on my drop off appointment.

There says an owner of a photon red FE.

As an ex-photon red FE owner I totally agree. Under H484 I traded in mine for a portofino blue 2024. 5 yrs of warranty. Up graded infotainment etc. Seemed a no brainer.

 

[Photon2.0eV]

@Qtown charger : It appears to me you still carry a torch for your Photon Red FE as noted by your avatar.

 

[dplaser]

Here are a few that seem to meet the criteria...

Used 2022 Jaguar I-PACE For Sale at Jaguar Arrowhead | VIN: SADHD2S19N1621266

Used 2022 Jaguar I-PACE For Sale at Jaguar Arrowhead | VIN: SADHD2S13N1619187

Used 2022 Jaguar I-PACE For Sale at Jaguar Arrowhead | VIN: SADHD2S13N1622347

Used 2022 Jaguar I-PACE For Sale at Jaguar Hartford | VIN: SADHD2S19N1619355

Maybe I'm too pragmatic, but I would take an extra 3 years of warranty and fewer 12V battery issues over a specific interior color.

It's just unfathomable to me to turn down an offer that is $10,000 above current value. I'll post my story in a separate thread. Just waiting on my drop off appointment.

Nobody will be buying those used cars for that amount unless that are nuts.

 

[ipace_wanted]

Stranger things have happened. Jaguar is paying that for 2019 models…

 

[ipace_wanted]

Nobody will be buying those used cars for that amount unless that are nuts.

Stranger things have happened. Jaguar is paying that for 2019 models…