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Thanks for sharing that. I will try to avoid chargepoint when possible (which is every day, except when I'm on road trips and there's no alternative).
 

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Part of the article is a bit sticky.
It says ChargePoint (not a personal favorite) has teamed up with Chevron to stop EVs.

What it appears, is that both Chevron and ChargePoint (perhaps others) are against Electric Utilities from dominating the market for EV charging.
They often have very deep pockets and are monopolies in many areas who get a guaranteed profit.
If utilities enter the market, they buy their power cheaper than private companies, and control power costs to customers.
At first this seems good, until the utilities have a monopoly on EV charging. And we know how monopolies behave when allowed to.

I'd rather have gas stations and private companies compete for EV charging. There are 144,000 gas stations in the US. If each one had a charger, that would be good thing.
 

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Part of the article is a bit sticky...

I'd rather have gas stations and private companies compete for EV charging. There are 144,000 gas stations in the US. If each one had a charger, that would be good thing.
I usually agree with you, but I'm not so sure this time around. It's a tough call between public (regulated) utilities and the oil company oligopoly. Right now there aren't any oil companies in the mix, and I see almost no price competition in the U.S. at charging stations. If anything, the EV charging prices either match or exceed the cost of gasoline.

That, of course, was not my concern with ChargePoint's patent ploy claiming they "invented" use of networking with charge stations, something Tesla has had for years. I would also note they chose to pick on the little guy with limited funds rather than Tesla.

Some might argue that the patent system is broken. It's worth noting that the reason is in large part because of a*holes like ChargePoint with their frivolous patent claims.
 

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I am going to go a little sideways and say this: I think ultimately the charging infrastructure should be run by private companies, but it can only happen if its an economic viable business plan. In order for this to happen two things must happen:

1) I think there has to a government subsidy or funded, well planned, initial infrastructure push to put in the functioning skeleton of a system. Without this BEVs will always be limited, and its the start of chicken and the egg problem. Without BEVs needing charging no company will commit resources to "wait for a market" to appear. Tesla did it because it was trying to sell its product.

2) Past this point there needs to be plan to transition existing and/or new infrastructure to private. An initial subsidy may prompt this. A lot of energy companies in the US get quite a bit of tax breaks and subsidies for exploration or development of new sources. This should be treated the same.

The last hurdle will be pricing, but obviously if there was a large number of charging stations then market forces could level things out. I think a charging company can afford to set very different rates if the station is in use 10 hours a day or more vs just around 1-2 hours.
 

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The last hurdle will be pricing, but obviously if there was a large number of charging stations then market forces could level things out. I think a charging company can afford to set very different rates if the station is in use 10 hours a day or more vs just around 1-2 hours.
Just curious. When is the last time you saw a price war at gas stations? At least in our neck of the woods, you can drive by a dozen gas stations, and there won't be a penny's difference in their pricing. In an oligopoly-driven market economy (which I suspect will happen with EV charging stations as well), there is virtually no price competition. They all simply agree to get rich at the expense of consumers.

Funny story. When I was in law school taking a class on corporations, the professor was espousing all the criminal penalties for price fixing when one of my fellow students began laughing. The professor, obviously perturbed, asked what was so funny. The student replied that he was paying his way through law school by working for a gas station down the street from the law school. He said one of his jobs was to attend the Sunday night meetings of the gas station owners in town where they would set the prices for gasoline for the coming week. And that was before the consolidation of the oil industry into a handful of companies. So... I wouldn't count on competition being a driving force in the EV marketplace.
 

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Valid point, and there are many ways to manipulate the system. It is then up to regulation and rules to prevent this and to allow the theory of "free market" to work. It doesn't just work by itself as some believe.

I was more talking about the cost/pricing model to sustain a business. The cost of install, maintenance has to be distributed by use. And right now I think a lot of charging stations are mostly idle due to not enough users. And there are not enough users partly because there isn't enough of an infrastructure.
 

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I usually agree with you, but I'm not so sure this time around. It's a tough call between public (regulated) utilities and the oil company oligopoly. Right now there aren't any oil companies in the mix, and I see almost no price competition in the U.S. at charging stations. If anything, the EV charging prices either match or exceed the cost of gasoline.

That, of course, was not my concern with ChargePoint's patent ploy claiming they "invented" use of networking with charge stations, something Tesla has had for years. I would also note they chose to pick on the little guy with limited funds rather than Tesla.

Some might argue that the patent system is broken. It's worth noting that the reason is in large part because of a*holes like ChargePoint with their frivolous patent claims.
The only 'gas station' chains I've personally seen with DCFC support are Terrible Hebst, and Maverik. There are others.

Having dealt extensively with Southern California Edison for years, I trust a used car lot more.

I wonder how much SCE/CPUC had to do with delaying the California EV Corridors we paid for? I don't trust either one, because they are basically the same entity.
 
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FYI. Chargepoint has started 20% off sale until the end of June and the buyer can get a $50 credit towards charging at Chargepoint chargers away from home, provided the home charger is activated by the end of July.
 

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That would be a regulated monopoly. I would be fine just adding the kWh to my residential bill.
Our regulated monopoly has a board of utility company executives. Hence why California power is some of the most expensive in the US.
 

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I think it has more to do with the fact CA has mostly investor owned Electric utilities vs municipal owned.
We just pay pay pay forever that guaranteed return on assets buying them over and over again.
 

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I think it has more to do with the fact CA has mostly investor owned Electric utilities vs municipal owned.
We just pay pay pay forever that guaranteed return on assets buying them over and over again.

As former California resident, I remember the promise of deregulation and privatization in the 70s. Fundamental things like power were supposed to be best handled by privatization, without concern that shareholders expect a return. California does have some municipalities that still manage their own power and offer lower rates than PG&E or Southern Edison.
https://www.energy.ca.gov/maps/serviceareas/electric_service_areas.html
Unfortunately the California Energy Commission doesn't report rates in an easy to locate database. You have to go to each provider for their tariff sheets. Modesto Irrigation District is about 5 cents cheaper than PG&E per tier, but PG&E has far too many rate plans for the average consumer to figure out.


And we can't forget that lobbying in California pays dividends for Utilities that are privately run. You can get regulation changes that allow you to defer maintenance in order to meet profit targets.
 
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