Electrify America app available and pricing changes - Page 2 - Jaguar I-Pace EV400 Forum
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post #11 of 25 (permalink) Old 06-07-2019, 09:56 PM
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I used Electrify America Stations three times recently on my trip back and forth from NY to Virginia Beach last week. Pricing was exactly as McRat got, and honestly I was VERY HAPPY to find a charger supplying above 50 kwh. SO charging for the first 30 min at over 80 Kwh was fantastic. My time is valuable so if you look at it that way it more than worth 14 and hour for me not to have to sit and watch my car charge for the rare times I take it away from home requiring a charger.

Just my 2 cents
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post #12 of 25 (permalink) Old 06-08-2019, 05:38 AM
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PGhiron: you are absolutely correct in that the time is much more valuable than the cost. My concern is with high pricing it prevents the use and adoption of public charging infrastructure as an option for most people. And this is creates a bad catch 22: the charging companies need to price so they can be profitable, yet if they price it as such people wont use it so they cant be. Part of it is the use cycle vs cost of infrastructure, its like a gas station that gets used once a day having to stay open from that one gas sale.

I actually will always use public charging anywhere it is installed even if I dont need it simply to increase the use/income of the units that ChargePoint and others install in my region. But the chicken and the egg problem (cant buy a BEV because not enough charging/not enough charging because not enough customers) is a hard one to break with just private company involvement.
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post #13 of 25 (permalink) Old 06-08-2019, 09:04 AM
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My problem with I-Pace and price change is that we are so close to the break point, that the time advantage of running at 84 kW peak is silly. You aren't going to notice the difference.

I sat down and did the actual math. The best case scenario will see <4 minutes advantage of 84 kW charging over 75 kW charging, which would be 10% to 60% SOC charging. Even 84kW is not a flat 84kW during it's period. The period of time where 84 kW is an advantage is never more than 30 minutes, and the average advantage is only 8 kW. The "104 kW" readings reported by EA are very brief and have no effect I can see in charging time. The EVgo 350 kW charger is not slower than the EA 350's even though the EA reports higher. Over double your fees for a 3 minute earlier departure on a 30 minute session?
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post #14 of 25 (permalink) Old 06-08-2019, 10:14 PM
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I live in VAB and would be doing the trip to NY. Do you go through DC or down the peninsula? I prefer driving the peninsula, but not sure if there are any charging stations there? Curious how you go once you hit Philly and where do you charge?
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post #15 of 25 (permalink) Old 06-08-2019, 10:44 PM
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Go to www.plugshare.com
Go to settings (upper left), and select CCS/SAE only.
They now have a Trip Planner function on the left scroll window near the bottom.
This will show you all the CCS stations on the way, and you can read reviews about them.

You should practice charging near your home a few times, especially if you have more than one carrier. Because doing it in the day time when it's not raining is a lot better for learning.

Typical Method:

Leave the car on with the door open and make sure the cable will reach. Adjust as necessary.
Get your payment method, phone app, credit card, or RFID card ready, and your fob.
Turn off car, open charge door, remove small rubber boot from bottom DC connectors.
Grab cable and insert until it snaps securely.
Follow instructions on the screen, or hold your RFID card on the reader image (looks like a WiFi symbol). Or use your cellphone app. Credit cards require you wait until asked, and remove when asked.
Charging past 85% will start to slow down fairly rapidly. Plan spacing at about 100-125 miles for best travel time. That way you can drive as fast as you like within reason, and always be charging at a faster speed.
Arrive with 20%-30% charge to 75%-85% and you are good to go.

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Last edited by McRat; 06-08-2019 at 10:47 PM.
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post #16 of 25 (permalink) Old 06-09-2019, 02:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by McRat View Post
My problem with I-Pace and price change is that we are so close to the break point, that the time advantage of running at 84 kW peak is silly. You aren't going to notice the difference.
The problem is not with the I-Pace, it is with the EA pricing scheme which is not consumer friendly. You should be paying for the energy you use not for the potential energy you could have used.

Under the new pricing you would be paying $.58/kWh. I know you don't like me posting comparisons to Tesla but the Supercharger network is the only comparable DCFC network in the US. Tesla charges per kWh in every jurisdiction where that is allowed. The average Supercharger rate in the US in $.28/kWh, which is less than half your EA pricing. Where Tesla is forced to charge per minute here are the rates:
$ 0.26 per minute above 60 kW
$ 0.13 per minute at or below 60 kW
This is also less than half the EA pricing.

Hopefully EA will get enough consumer feedback to force them to change their pricing. The one caveat is I don't expect any real competition for EA. The Dieselgate settlement has forced them to build an extensive charging network without have to justify the returns for a $2B capital investment. No competitor has the "luxury" of that which will make it difficult for other charging networks to raise the capital necessary to compete with EA.
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post #17 of 25 (permalink) Old 06-09-2019, 08:45 AM
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Originally Posted by dennis View Post
The problem is not with the I-Pace, it is with the EA pricing scheme which is not consumer friendly. You should be paying for the energy you use not for the potential energy you could have used.

Under the new pricing you would be paying $.58/kWh. I know you don't like me posting comparisons to Tesla but the Supercharger network is the only comparable DCFC network in the US. Tesla charges per kWh in every jurisdiction where that is allowed. The average Supercharger rate in the US in $.28/kWh, which is less than half your EA pricing. Where Tesla is forced to charge per minute here are the rates:
$ 0.26 per minute above 60 kW
$ 0.13 per minute at or below 60 kW
This is also less than half the EA pricing.

Hopefully EA will get enough consumer feedback to force them to change their pricing. The one caveat is I don't expect any real competition for EA. The Dieselgate settlement has forced them to build an extensive charging network without have to justify the returns for a $2B capital investment. No competitor has the "luxury" of that which will make it difficult for other charging networks to raise the capital necessary to compete with EA.
In California there are 2 rates structure plans (new) for 2019 for DCFC's. 20-500kW peak demand during any 15 minutes of a month, $0.08 to $0.49 per kWh depending on TOU and season plus $117 meter rental. This was Demand Metered until recently.

For over 500kW peak for any 15 minutes, $0.07-0.045 per kWh + $432 meter rental per month.

I would like to think my letters complaining about the unfair Demand Tariffs had something to do with it. They were much higher for DCFC charging.

Comparing Tesla costs is pointless. Tesla is an anti-profit management system. They lose bucketloads of cash a day on the SC system, something a for-profit corporation cannot endure for a year, much less a decade.

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Last edited by McRat; 06-09-2019 at 08:51 AM.
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post #18 of 25 (permalink) Old 06-09-2019, 12:19 PM
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Quote:
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My problem with I-Pace and price change is that we are so close to the break point, that the time advantage of running at 84 kW peak is silly. You aren't going to notice the difference.
Completely agree. I would set the max charging at 70/75 if it was available on the charger or the vehicle. Not going to notice the time delta.

I must say after looking at the EA app the existing/planned coverage looks pretty good for what I may need.
Although missing for me is NV93 from Vegas to Twin Falls.
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post #19 of 25 (permalink) Old 06-09-2019, 12:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Time2Roll View Post
Completely agree. I would set the max charging at 70/75 if it was available on the charger or the vehicle. Not going to notice the time delta.

I must say after looking at the EA app the existing/planned coverage looks pretty good for what I may need.
Although missing for me is NV93 from Vegas to Twin Falls.
Now I know why some Teslas use CHAdeMO on I-15 N of Vegas. CCS/CHAdeMO has better coverage. Even up the 93, while there is only 1 CCS, that 1 more site than Tesla has. You would look for L2 chargers or RV hookups.

But right now, Tesla will take you up via the 15 and CCS will not.

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Last edited by McRat; 06-09-2019 at 12:36 PM.
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post #20 of 25 (permalink) Old 06-11-2019, 07:47 PM Thread Starter
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EA and ChargePoint have reached an agreement for "roaming agreement".

https://www.chargepoint.com/about/ne...arging-access/
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